FAQ
Thanks Brad and Mark for your helpful and detailed replies.

I have reached a point where I have the lists almost working but there are
some issues still preventing the systems from functioning in a way that
allows me to confident to launch these lists I wish to create.

Apple's support has been MIA at best so I have given up and decided to seek
other alternatives. Also, the numerous individuals I have spoken with at
Apple were clearly (1) not interested in making any improvements or fixing
the current issues with the version of Mailman that ships with OS X Server
and (2) didn't know any more about it than I do (which is quite embarrassing
considering they are part of the company's business support department).

I can't imagine that there is anything other than some minor set-up issues
that need to be corrected with my system. After all, I am sending and
receiving e-mails and the lists are functional (to an extent anyway) as they
send and receive messages. However, as I stated above, I don't want to
launch the lists only to attract subscribers and then find out in a short
while that Mailman has stopped working because something with my system
wasn't set-up properly.

I also can't imagine that it would be too difficult to install a new version
of Mailman and manage it using its browser-based interface while ignoring
Apple's System Administrator tool for this specific task.

Brad, since you have this much experience with OS X Server would you be
interested in helping me with my problem ? In case you are, please contact
me off-list so that we can discuss it. I believe you should be able to
connect remotely, right ? In case you are not interested, would you
recommend me someone who is knowledgeable on both OS X Server and Mailman ?
I have contacted numerous Apple consultants but couldn't find a single one
who had any experience with Mailman.

Thanks again for your helpful replies.

Best regards,

Joe

---------------
On 3/30/11 5:36 PM, "Brad Knowles" wrote:
On Mar 30, 2011, at 6:15 PM, JRC Groups wrote:

Is there anyone on the list who is familiar with both OS X Server and
Mailman to help with this problem ? I am willing to pay a consultation fee
to someone who can connect to my server remotely and help solve this issue.
I've been an Apple consultant, at least part-time. I came within a hairs
breadth of doing that job full-time for a local Apple VAR. I've got all the
PDF versions of all the official Apple documentation on Mac OS X and Mac OS X
Server, as well as PDF versions of the good 3rd party books on the subject.
And I've been a professional Unix system administrator and consultant for over
twenty years.

The guy who used to run lists.apple.com was involved in the development and
support of Mailman long before I came along, and has more experience in the
business than I do.

I don't mean to sound pessimistic or to rain on your parade, but in both
cases, the solution was to blow away the stuff that Apple ships, and to
install the "real deal" code as downloaded from list.org.


The Mailman project is freely available open source (under a GNU license, no
less), and the support we provide is best effort. There is no commercial
version of Mailman that we sell or officially support. Anyone else that
includes Mailman as part of a commercial product or service that they sell,
should include with that a full after-sales support staff.


Note that there isn't going to be a separate "Server" edition of Mac OS X
"Lion".

No one seems to know if this means that all the stuff that the "Server"
edition used to include will now be available to everyone, and that all the
people who developed the "Server" edition of Mac OS X have been transitioned
over to the mainline code development team, or if that means that a lot of
products and services will get thrown out the door as Apple re-focuses
exclusively on the retail/home user market.

But that is certainly something that you should keep in mind as you look
towards solutions in this space.

--
Brad Knowles <brad at shub-internet.org>
LinkedIn Profile: <http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>

Search Discussions

  • Larry Stone at Apr 3, 2011 at 1:46 pm

    On 4/3/11 1:42 AM, JRC Groups at joemailgroups at gmail.com wrote:


    I also can't imagine that it would be too difficult to install a new version
    of Mailman and manage it using its browser-based interface while ignoring
    Apple's System Administrator tool for this specific task.
    It should not be difficult. I'll repeat what I posted Wednesday:

    "I'll add that there are a number of here who run Mailman on OS X "Client".
    Searching the archives, you will find full step-by-step directions for
    installing it. Blowing away the Apple provided Mailman (or just ignoring it)
    and installing a clean unmodified version from source will give you, on OS X
    Server, the same as those of on "Client" have."

    Going through the process yourself will teach you far more than having
    someone do it for you.

    --
    Larry Stone
    lstone19 at stonejongleux.com
    http://www.stonejongleux.com/
  • Brad Knowles at Apr 5, 2011 at 7:02 pm
    Sorry, my wife's computer has been down for days, and in the meanwhile she as taken over mine. At this point, all I've got is an iPad and a semi-wonky server in the closet, and neither of them is well suited for keeping up with lots of email. I'll fix that when I get her computer repaired and back into her hands so that I can get my computer back, but until then I'm going to be even more of an absentee admin for this list than normal.

    I may actually be getting a job soon doing Enterprise Mac OS X consulting, and if I do then I will let you folks know. If that happens, then I could potentially be available to do remote consulting for this kind of stuff through my employer.

    --
    Brad Knowles
    Sent from my iPad
    On Apr 3, 2011, at 1:42 AM, JRC Groups wrote:

    Thanks Brad and Mark for your helpful and detailed replies.

    I have reached a point where I have the lists almost working but there are
    some issues still preventing the systems from functioning in a way that
    allows me to confident to launch these lists I wish to create.

    Apple's support has been MIA at best so I have given up and decided to seek
    other alternatives. Also, the numerous individuals I have spoken with at
    Apple were clearly (1) not interested in making any improvements or fixing
    the current issues with the version of Mailman that ships with OS X Server
    and (2) didn't know any more about it than I do (which is quite embarrassing
    considering they are part of the company's business support department).

    I can't imagine that there is anything other than some minor set-up issues
    that need to be corrected with my system. After all, I am sending and
    receiving e-mails and the lists are functional (to an extent anyway) as they
    send and receive messages. However, as I stated above, I don't want to
    launch the lists only to attract subscribers and then find out in a short
    while that Mailman has stopped working because something with my system
    wasn't set-up properly.

    I also can't imagine that it would be too difficult to install a new version
    of Mailman and manage it using its browser-based interface while ignoring
    Apple's System Administrator tool for this specific task.

    Brad, since you have this much experience with OS X Server would you be
    interested in helping me with my problem ? In case you are, please contact
    me off-list so that we can discuss it. I believe you should be able to
    connect remotely, right ? In case you are not interested, would you
    recommend me someone who is knowledgeable on both OS X Server and Mailman ?
    I have contacted numerous Apple consultants but couldn't find a single one
    who had any experience with Mailman.

    Thanks again for your helpful replies.

    Best regards,

    Joe

    ---------------
    On 3/30/11 5:36 PM, "Brad Knowles" wrote:
    On Mar 30, 2011, at 6:15 PM, JRC Groups wrote:

    Is there anyone on the list who is familiar with both OS X Server and
    Mailman to help with this problem ? I am willing to pay a consultation fee
    to someone who can connect to my server remotely and help solve this issue.
    I've been an Apple consultant, at least part-time. I came within a hairs
    breadth of doing that job full-time for a local Apple VAR. I've got all the
    PDF versions of all the official Apple documentation on Mac OS X and Mac OS X
    Server, as well as PDF versions of the good 3rd party books on the subject.
    And I've been a professional Unix system administrator and consultant for over
    twenty years.

    The guy who used to run lists.apple.com was involved in the development and
    support of Mailman long before I came along, and has more experience in the
    business than I do.

    I don't mean to sound pessimistic or to rain on your parade, but in both
    cases, the solution was to blow away the stuff that Apple ships, and to
    install the "real deal" code as downloaded from list.org.


    The Mailman project is freely available open source (under a GNU license, no
    less), and the support we provide is best effort. There is no commercial
    version of Mailman that we sell or officially support. Anyone else that
    includes Mailman as part of a commercial product or service that they sell,
    should include with that a full after-sales support staff.


    Note that there isn't going to be a separate "Server" edition of Mac OS X
    "Lion".

    No one seems to know if this means that all the stuff that the "Server"
    edition used to include will now be available to everyone, and that all the
    people who developed the "Server" edition of Mac OS X have been transitioned
    over to the mainline code development team, or if that means that a lot of
    products and services will get thrown out the door as Apple re-focuses
    exclusively on the retail/home user market.

    But that is certainly something that you should keep in mind as you look
    towards solutions in this space.

    --
    Brad Knowles <brad at shub-internet.org>
    LinkedIn Profile: <http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>
  • JRC Groups at Apr 7, 2011 at 2:24 am
    Mark,


    Thank you for your helpful reply.

    Considering Brad isn't available at this time, would you know of anyone you
    could recommend who is experienced with OS X Server to help me with my
    problem ?

    All I need is for someone who is experienced with OS Server and understands
    its System Administrator tool to log in on my server remotely and review my
    settings to make sure I haven't done anything wrong and possibly make a few
    corrections if they happen to be necessary. It goes without saying that I
    will be happy to pay for the consultation fee.

    After I am sure that everything is set-up properly on the server I will then
    continue with Mailman and decide whether I should just use the one bundled
    with OS X Server or if I should download it and do new install.

    Thank you,


    Joe

    ------------------

    On 3/28/11 1:27 PM, "Mark Sapiro" wrote:

    JRC Groups wrote:
    While discussing some possible DNS set-up issues I might need to resolve on
    my server a certain IT professional mentioned to me that Mailman shouldn't
    be run using a virtual domain. I am not sure if this professional was
    referring to virtual domains in general or only those running on Mac OS X
    Server.

    Just a quick addendum to Brad's response. From the point of view of the
    mail server rather than Mailman, There should be full circle DNS.
    I.e., an rDNS lookup of the server's IP address should give a
    host/domain name and a lookup of that name should return an A record
    (not a CNAME) with the same IP. Also, when sending mail, the server
    should identify itself in HELO with the same name.

    These things should be true for any mail server regardless of Mailman.

    Now if a mailman list is in a virtual domain, the envelope sender of
    messages from that list will be the virtual domain. This is fine, but
    if the virtual domain publishes an SPF record, it needs to specify the
    server's name as a permitted sender.
  • Mark Sapiro at Apr 7, 2011 at 2:28 am

    JRC Groups wrote:
    Considering Brad isn't available at this time, would you know of anyone you
    could recommend who is experienced with OS X Server to help me with my
    problem ?

    I'm sorry, I don't know anyone to recommend.

    --
    Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
  • Ch Abarguia at Apr 7, 2011 at 11:57 am
    Try someone from http://www.afp548.com/
    On 07 Apr 2011, at 04:28, Mark Sapiro wrote:

    JRC Groups wrote:
    Considering Brad isn't available at this time, would you know of anyone you
    could recommend who is experienced with OS X Server to help me with my
    problem ?

    I'm sorry, I don't know anyone to recommend.

    --
    Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

    ------------------------------------------------------
    Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
    http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
    Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
    Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
    Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
    Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/ch.abarguia%40gmail.com
  • Ch Abarguia at Apr 7, 2011 at 12:07 pm
    Have you contacted http://osx.topicdesk.com/content/section/4/41/ ?
    The have tools and good reputation for mac os x server support services

    Consultancy : http://osx.topicdesk.com/content/view/12/36/

    On 07 Apr 2011, at 04:28, Mark Sapiro wrote:

    JRC Groups wrote:
    Considering Brad isn't available at this time, would you know of anyone you
    could recommend who is experienced with OS X Server to help me with my
    problem ?

    I'm sorry, I don't know anyone to recommend.

    --
    Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

    ------------------------------------------------------
    Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
    http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
    Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
    Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
    Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
    Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/ch.abarguia%40gmail.com

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