FAQ
Can you use mailman on a server other than the one where the DNS is pointing
to?

I have a website abc123.com and it's hosted on Host A. Host A does not
allow Mailman on cpanel. Host B does. I set up a list called "
bot at abc123.com" on Host B while also setting up abc123.com as an addon
domain. Is there any way to make this work? It doesn't seem to work now
even though I have "Remote Mail Exchanger" chosen for the MX value.

--
Adam

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  • Adam McGreggor at Jun 15, 2010 at 2:30 pm

    On Mon, Jun 14, 2010 at 07:16:26PM -0400, Adam Parker, OD wrote:
    I have a website abc123.com and it's hosted on Host A. Host A does not
    allow Mailman on cpanel. Host B does. I set up a list called "
    bot at abc123.com" on Host B while also setting up abc123.com as an addon
    domain. Is there any way to make this work?
    Firstly, where you're using "abc123.com", I presume you don't actually
    mean "abc123.com"[1].

    Secondly, I know *nothing* about what cPanel offers, let alone how
    they've re-modified Mailman -- apart from what I've read in previous
    posts (and there are a few).

    Using a different name on "Host B" (differing to "Host A")
    might alllow, for say, <list-foo at hostb.example.com> something like

    (a) ProxyPass and ProxyPassReverse /mailman/ (and /pipermail) to hostb

    (b) forward the mails for the mailman parts (e.g,
    <list-foo{admin,bounces,confirm,join,leave,owner,request,subscribe,unsubscribe}@example.com>
    ->
    <list-foo{admin,bounces,confirm,join,leave,owner,request,subscribe,unsubscribe}@hostb.example.com>)
    to hostb

    in your scenario.

    It would almost certainly be easier/less hassle, to use a separate
    name for hostb (e.g., make hostb "lists.example.org", and then just
    use normal look-ups to point your lists (mail and web) to hostb),
    with all the Mailman stuff taking place on hostb

    [1] that is to say:
    Domain Name: ABC123.COM
    Registrar: TIERRANET INC. D/B/A DOMAINDISCOVER
    Whois Server: whois.domaindiscover.com
    Referral URL: http://www.domaindiscover.com
    Name Server: NS1.DOMAINDISCOVER.COM
    Name Server: NS2.DOMAINDISCOVER.COM
    Status: clientTransferProhibited
    Updated Date: 19-aug-2009
    Creation Date: 19-aug-1995
    Expiration Date: 18-aug-2010
    Last update of whois database: Tue, 15 Jun 2010 14:25:35 UTC <<<
    --
    ``Whether intentionally or not, fish control and potato control were billeted
    together in St. John's College, Oxford, making this ancient seat of higher
    learning the biggest fish and chip shop the world has ever seen.''
    (Peter Hennessey, on the organisation of wartime rationing)
  • Adam Parker, OD at Jun 15, 2010 at 3:47 pm
    no, i'm not actually using that domain. Cpanel allows you to easily set up
    a list - it just asks you for the name of the list and a password and does
    the rest for you. The problem is that the server the Mailman/List resides
    on is not the server that houses the email server. So i'm looking for a way
    for the 2nd server to be able to monitor the emails from the email server.
    I went into the panel and there's a place to alter the MX record - one
    option is for "Remote Mail Exchanger" which I thought would work, but it
    doesn't. I'm not sure this is possible, but was hoping there'd be a way to
    use Mailman when the emails are not on same server.
    -Adam

    On Tue, Jun 15, 2010 at 10:30 AM, Adam McGreggor
    wrote:
    On Mon, Jun 14, 2010 at 07:16:26PM -0400, Adam Parker, OD wrote:
    I have a website abc123.com and it's hosted on Host A. Host A does not
    allow Mailman on cpanel. Host B does. I set up a list called "
    bot at abc123.com" on Host B while also setting up abc123.com as an addon
    domain. Is there any way to make this work?
    Firstly, where you're using "abc123.com", I presume you don't actually
    mean "abc123.com"[1].

    Secondly, I know *nothing* about what cPanel offers, let alone how
    they've re-modified Mailman -- apart from what I've read in previous
    posts (and there are a few).

    Using a different name on "Host B" (differing to "Host A")
    might alllow, for say, <list-foo at hostb.example.com> something like

    (a) ProxyPass and ProxyPassReverse /mailman/ (and /pipermail) to hostb

    (b) forward the mails for the mailman parts (e.g,

    <list-foo{admin,bounces,confirm,join,leave,owner,request,subscribe,
    unsubscribe}@example.com <unsubscribe%7D at example.com>>
    ->

    <list-foo{admin,bounces,confirm,join,leave,owner,request,subscribe,
    unsubscribe}@hostb.example.com <unsubscribe%7D at hostb.example.com>>)
    to hostb

    in your scenario.

    It would almost certainly be easier/less hassle, to use a separate
    name for hostb (e.g., make hostb "lists.example.org", and then just
    use normal look-ups to point your lists (mail and web) to hostb),
    with all the Mailman stuff taking place on hostb

    [1] that is to say:
    Domain Name: ABC123.COM
    Registrar: TIERRANET INC. D/B/A DOMAINDISCOVER
    Whois Server: whois.domaindiscover.com
    Referral URL: http://www.domaindiscover.com
    Name Server: NS1.DOMAINDISCOVER.COM
    Name Server: NS2.DOMAINDISCOVER.COM
    Status: clientTransferProhibited
    Updated Date: 19-aug-2009
    Creation Date: 19-aug-1995
    Expiration Date: 18-aug-2010
    Last update of whois database: Tue, 15 Jun 2010 14:25:35 UTC <<<
    --
    ``Whether intentionally or not, fish control and potato control were
    billeted
    together in St. John's College, Oxford, making this ancient seat of higher
    learning the biggest fish and chip shop the world has ever seen.''
    (Peter Hennessey, on the organisation of wartime rationing)


    --
    Adam P. Parker, OD, FVAO
    Drs. Robinson & Parker
    President, Richmond Optometric Society
    (804) 595-2020
  • Andrew Hodgson at Jun 15, 2010 at 4:06 pm

    Adam Parker, OD wrote:
    no, i'm not actually using that domain. Cpanel allows you to easily set up a list - it just asks you for the name of the list and a password and does >the rest for you. The problem is that the server the Mailman/List resides on is not the server that houses the email server. So i'm looking for a >way for the 2nd server to be able to monitor the emails from the email server.
    I went into the panel and there's a place to alter the MX record - one option is for "Remote Mail Exchanger" which I thought would work, but it >doesn't. I'm not sure this is possible, but was hoping there'd be a way to use Mailman when the emails are not on same server.
    Firstly, this list is not really set up to support users using the CPanel version of Mailman, which is altered to work with the CPanel setup. We can only usually advise on a version of Mailman built from source, or that you can run the standard binaries on without breaking a CPanel list.

    Having said that...

    I understand you have two hosts - one running CPanel and Mailman, and one not. You have moved your site over to the new host, but want to continue with the old host for the Mailman hosting. There are two options as I see it:

    1. Use the old Host to host the mail system for your domain. This essentially means pointing the MX records at your old host, then letting them handle mail forwarding, Mailman hosting, and mail hosting. The new host wouldn't concern itself about mail.

    2. Move the list to a subdomain inside your domain, i.e., lists.example.com. The MX records for your domain would point at the new mail server, but the MX records for the subdomain would point at the Mailman host.

    Thanks.
    Andrew.
  • Stephen J. Turnbull at Jun 16, 2010 at 2:46 am
    Adam Parker, OD writes:
    no, i'm not actually using that domain. Cpanel allows you to easily set up
    a list - it just asks you for the name of the list and a password and does
    the rest for you.
    Actually, cPanel itself doesn't do anything except allow the hosting
    staff to avoid interacting with clients on client-specific stuff.
    It's the staff of the cPanel host that does the host configuration
    work you don't want to do (quite reasonably; or perhaps you aren't
    allowed to do it on those hosts).

    I gather from the suffix to your name that you are a professional.
    Well, web hosting (including mail) is a profession, too, but the
    ethical side of professionalism is often slighted in favor of low-cost
    high-volume operation, of which a very common symptom is ... you
    guessed it ... cPanel. Pros can use cPanel, too, of course, but if
    your cPanel host were run by pros, they would be telling you how to
    get this job done.

    My recommendation is that you talk to a reputable professional about
    getting your needs met with minimum work on your part. They'll help
    you figure out what your needs really are, among other things. There
    are a couple listed on the Mailman wiki, I think. Most likely the
    kind of service you want is only marginally more expensive (and
    possibly as little as $4/month) than what you've got. Even if it
    turns out to be more than you want to pay, you'll have a better idea
    of the possibilities (and your own needs) when you're done.

    http://wiki.list.org/display/COM/Mailman+hosting+services
    http://wiki.list.org/display/COM/Mailman+consulting+services

    "Consulting" seems to be oriented toward extensive customizations,
    probably not what you need. Of the "hosting" services, EMWD staff are
    known to contribute on this list, FWIW. If you contact a service, you
    might want to check the archives (use Google's site:mail.python.org
    option) to see if the people you talk to hang out here in a visible
    way, and whether they talk sense at your level. Many probably lurk
    without saying anything, though. ("They also serve who stand and
    wait.")
    I went into the panel and there's a place to alter the MX record -
    one option is for "Remote Mail Exchanger" which I thought would
    work, but it doesn't.
    It can't work, because the configuration that needs to change is on
    the email server, not on the cPanel host. Unlike your personal mail
    client which works by "pulling" mail from a specific host, the mail
    system itself works by "pushing" mail from one host to the next (along
    a route it looks up in the domain name directory service) until it
    reaches the destination. If you don't know that much about the mail
    system yet, it will be a big investment to get the knowledge and
    skills needed to make this work ... and you very well may not be
    permitted to do the necessary configuration yourself by your hosting
    service(s).

    If you do want to do this yourself anyway, I recommend the solution
    that several others have already offered: set up a lists.YourDomain
    subdomain in the DNS, whose A and MX records point to the cPanel host.
    No muss, no fuss once it's done, but if the email and cPanel hosts are
    run by separate companies, getting the DNS configuration done could be
    modestly annoying depending on how much freedom the email host gives
    you to delegate subdomains.
  • Grant Taylor at Jun 16, 2010 at 2:45 am

    Adam Parker, OD wrote:
    Can you use mailman on a server other than the one where the DNS is
    pointing to?
    Technically there is nothing requiring Mailman to be running on your
    mail server.

    In theory, there is no reason why each address for the mailing list(s)
    can't be a pop3 mail box that is polled for messages to feed in to
    Mailman. Though this type of set up is out side of the scope of
    Mailman. (It would be more in the scope of downloading messages from a
    mail box and piping them in to standard in of a program.)
    I have a website abc123.com and it's hosted on Host A. Host A does
    not allow Mailman on cpanel. Host B does. I set up a list called
    "bot at abc123.com" on Host B while also setting up abc123.com as an
    addon domain. Is there any way to make this work? It doesn't seem
    to work now even though I have "Remote Mail Exchanger" chosen for the
    MX value.
    Purely from an email administration / routing point of view, you
    normally don't want the same domain to be handled by multiple servers.
    (I say normally because there are some special configurations where this
    is explicitly made to work.)

    What you will end up with is each server will only work with (handle
    email for) it's incomplete list addresses. I.e. host A will not about
    accounts 1 and 2 but not accounts 3 or 4. Similarly host B will know
    about accounts 3 and 4 but not accounts 1 or 2.

    What would probably be better, as Adam McGreggor suggested, is to have
    email for the abc123.com domain to one server and have email to the
    mailing list addresses be forwarded to accounts in a different
    (sub)domain on the other server. I.e. bot at abc123.com would be forwarded
    to bot at lists.abc123.com.



    Grant. . . .

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groupmailman-users @
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postedJun 14, '10 at 11:16p
activeJun 16, '10 at 2:46a
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