FAQ

On 8/2/07, Steven Jones wrote:

I am trying to determine why emails to lists sometimes take well in
excess of an hour....sometimes 4....

Is there anyway to determine where the issue lies?
Look at the logs. Correlate the message-ids in the MTA logs
(sendmail, postfix, whatever) with the message-ids in the Mailman
logs (presumably in /usr/local/mailman/logs, or elsewhere as
appropriate for your installation), and then do the same for the
outbound traffic (going back to the MTA logs with the ids of the
messages as they are generated by Mailman).

That's about the only way I know of.

--
Brad Knowles <brad at shub-internet.org>, Consultant & Author
LinkedIn Profile: <http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>
Slides from Invited Talks: <http://tinyurl.com/tj6q4>

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  • Mark Sapiro at Aug 2, 2007 at 4:25 am

    Brad Knowles wrote:
    On 8/2/07, Steven Jones wrote:

    I am trying to determine why emails to lists sometimes take well in
    excess of an hour....sometimes 4....

    Is there anyway to determine where the issue lies?
    Look at the logs. Correlate the message-ids in the MTA logs
    (sendmail, postfix, whatever) with the message-ids in the Mailman
    logs (presumably in /usr/local/mailman/logs, or elsewhere as
    appropriate for your installation), and then do the same for the
    outbound traffic (going back to the MTA logs with the ids of the
    messages as they are generated by Mailman).

    That's about the only way I know of.

    Also see
    <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2007-July/057755.html>

    --
    Mark Sapiro <msapiro at value.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
  • Steven Jones at Aug 2, 2007 at 4:39 am
    Thanks to both, I don't think its DNS as the mailman server is
    smarthost'd in sendmail to go to a outgoing smtp server....so why it
    would do dns lookups I don't know...

    regards

    Steven Jones
    Senior Linux/Unix/San System Administrator
    APG -Technology Integration Team
    Victoria University of Wellington
    Phone: +64 4 463 6272 Mobile: +64 27 563 6272

    -----Original Message-----
    From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:msapiro at value.net]
    Sent: Thursday, 2 August 2007 4:25 p.m.
    To: Brad Knowles; Steven Jones; mailman-users at python.org
    Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Messages take over an hour to pass
    throughmailman

    Brad Knowles wrote:
    On 8/2/07, Steven Jones wrote:

    I am trying to determine why emails to lists sometimes take well in
    excess of an hour....sometimes 4....

    Is there anyway to determine where the issue lies?
    Look at the logs. Correlate the message-ids in the MTA logs
    (sendmail, postfix, whatever) with the message-ids in the Mailman
    logs (presumably in /usr/local/mailman/logs, or elsewhere as
    appropriate for your installation), and then do the same for the
    outbound traffic (going back to the MTA logs with the ids of the
    messages as they are generated by Mailman).

    That's about the only way I know of.

    Also see
    <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2007-July/057755.html>

    --
    Mark Sapiro <msapiro at value.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
  • Brad Knowles at Aug 2, 2007 at 4:56 am

    On 8/2/07, Steven Jones wrote:

    Thanks to both, I don't think its DNS as the mailman server is
    smarthost'd in sendmail to go to a outgoing smtp server....so why it
    would do dns lookups I don't know...
    It all depends on the MTA configuration of whatever machine Mailman
    is connecting to port 25 and doing the initial delivery. That's the
    machine you need to check. As far as this is concerned, there's
    nothing within Mailman itself that you can check or fix -- this is an
    MTA issue instead.

    --
    Brad Knowles <brad at shub-internet.org>, Consultant & Author
    LinkedIn Profile: <http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>
    Slides from Invited Talks: <http://tinyurl.com/tj6q4>

    09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
  • Steven Jones at Sep 6, 2010 at 11:06 pm
    Hi,

    My management want to move our listing function to Exchange 2k10....however we have a need to maintain the archives on the existing mailman server so ppl can search them.

    Is it possible to disable all of mailman's functions except search/browsing of the archive?

    regards

    Steven
  • Mark Sapiro at Sep 7, 2010 at 1:18 am

    Steven Jones wrote:
    My management want to move our listing function to Exchange 2k10....however we have a need to maintain the archives on the existing mailman server so ppl can search them.

    Is it possible to disable all of mailman's functions except search/browsing of the archive?

    If the archives are public, all you need is Mailman's archives/
    directory (both archives/private/ and archives/public/) and the
    pipermail alias in your web server. The rest can go unless there is
    some CGI for searching.

    If (some of) the archives are private, it's a little trickier because
    you have to maintain the 'private' CGI and the lists for
    authentication.

    In either case, perhaps the simplest approach is to stop Mailman and
    not start it again, remove the Mailman aliases or whatever the MTA
    uses to deliver to Mailman, and remove the 'listinfo' and perhaps
    other wrappers from Mailman's cgi-bin/ directory leaving maybe only
    'private' and anything relating to archive searching.

    You may or may not also want to remove Mailman's crontab so password
    reminders aren't sent.

    --
    Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
  • Adam McGreggor at Sep 7, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    On Mon, Sep 06, 2010 at 06:18:52PM -0700, Mark Sapiro wrote:
    Steven Jones wrote:
    My management want to move our listing function to Exchange 2k10....however we have a need to maintain the archives on the existing mailman server so ppl can search them.

    Is it possible to disable all of mailman's functions except search/browsing of the archive?
    If the archives are public, all you need is Mailman's archives/
    directory (both archives/private/ and archives/public/) and the
    pipermail alias in your web server. The rest can go unless there is
    some CGI for searching.

    If (some of) the archives are private, it's a little trickier because
    you have to maintain the 'private' CGI and the lists for
    authentication.
    Both of those assume that you(r managers) don't want to send the
    Exchange list mails to the archive, too. (perhaps, say, for
    continuoty reasons).
    In either case, perhaps the simplest approach is to stop Mailman and
    not start it again, remove the Mailman aliases or whatever the MTA
    uses to deliver to Mailman, and remove the 'listinfo' and perhaps
    other wrappers from Mailman's cgi-bin/ directory leaving maybe only
    'private' and anything relating to archive searching.
    If continuing the archive were to be the case, I'd ditch existing
    subscribers, control new subscriptions, add the Exchange address
    as an allowed sender and sort out implicit (if needed), carrying on
    from there.

    I've not played with Exchange 2010 lists. Are they any good? RFC
    compliant? Handling bounces?
    You may or may not also want to remove Mailman's crontab so password
    reminders aren't sent.
    :) but maybe not the archive building...

    --
    "applying logic to English slang is never a sound idea"
    -- Stephen Fry
  • Mark Sapiro at Sep 7, 2010 at 3:39 pm

    Adam McGreggor wrote:
    On Mon, Sep 06, 2010 at 06:18:52PM -0700, Mark Sapiro wrote:

    You may or may not also want to remove Mailman's crontab so password
    reminders aren't sent.
    :) but maybe not the archive building...

    If by archive building, you mean cron/nightly_gzip, I suggest removing
    that from all installations. All it does is gzip the periodic
    pseudo-mailbox (e.g. 2010-September.txt) so that the gzipped file is
    the "Downloadable version" linked on the archive TOC page. It saves no
    space because the un-gzipped version is retained (in fact, it uses
    additional space for the gzipped version), and the gzipped version is
    up to 24 hours behind and is thus usually incomplete.

    The only advantage is a possible saving of bandwith when one downloads
    the file, but this seems like an artifact from an earlier time.

    It might be worth it to gzip older files and remove the corresponding
    un-gzipped files, but this is not what is done by cron/nightly_gzip.

    --
    Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
  • Steven Jones at Sep 7, 2010 at 10:15 pm
    Hi,

    <rant>

    "They" dont want to create new mailman lists "anymore" as they have to be created by a Linux systems administrator (ie be root to edit /etc/aliases)...so 15mins a week is too much work...so they want to do it with "user admins" that are incapable of anything but AD/gui type work...and I wouldn't give them the root password....


    8><--------

    Both of those assume that you(r managers) don't want to send the
    Exchange list mails to the archive, too. (perhaps, say, for
    continuity reasons).

    8><--------

    ...I assume not as Mailman has to go as they dont want to keep creating new lists. Users might want it, in fact I bet they will...that would be funny.

    6 years ago they complained about the cost, the un-reliability and in-flexibility of Communigate and linux admins had to edit files by hand to change things for them...so I installed Mailman. Mailman has served them almost faultlessly for free in that 6 years (apart from probably my f*ups) so the TCO has been incredibly low....

    I will say that I have also has superb support from this list and Mark in particular over that time period, I will thank you all for that.......that has been priceless and shows up many commercial vendors...

    8><-----------

    I've not played with Exchange 2010 lists. Are they any good? RFC
    compliant? Handling bounces?

    8><----------

    Oh that's a nightmare I wont go into....someone wants it changed so it will I suspect get changed....even if it doesn't work very well and costs more time, but hey I don't do MS stuff and especially not Exchange so it wont be my little nightmare....I have advised them time and time again what they have is probably the best they can get especially considering its cost.

    </rant>

    regards and again, thanks
  • Stephen J. Turnbull at Sep 8, 2010 at 1:22 am
    Steven Jones writes:
    <rant>
    </rant>
    I sympathize with you (of course!), but remember, "nobody ever got
    fired for installing Microsoft". ;-)

    Keep on truckin', man!

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