FAQ
Banging my head against the wall ( and it hurts..)

On the different list from our Mailman mail list server, the mail goes out
fine except for users with a "verizon.net" address. Here is a typical
syslog entry:

Jun 26 12:57:29 secure sm-mta[13001]: k5QJv2Gt012804:
to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:00, xdelay�:00:00, mailer=esmtp, pri6103,
relay=relay.verizon.net. [206.46.232.11], dsn=5.0.0, stat=Service unavailable


But if I send that user an email from that same server (but not from
Mailman) the log shows:

Jun 26 14:23:05 secure sendmail[15184]: k5QLN5UB015181:
to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:00, xdelay�:00:00, mailer=relay, pri0295,
relay=[127.0.0.1] [127.0.0.1], dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent (k5QLN5kD015185 Message accepted for delivery)

Jun 26 14:23:12 secure sm-mta[15195]: k5QLN5kD015185: to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:07,
xdelay�:00:07, mailer=esmtp, pri0469, relay=relay.verizon.net.
[206.46.232.11], dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent (2.5.0 Ok.)


I'm at a loss. All the other mail gets delivered properly but not the
verizon.net mail.

This is a Debian system with Mailman version 2.1.5-8 (Debian's stable version).

Any ideas?

Thanks,

Ken

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  • Mark Sapiro at Jun 26, 2006 at 11:31 pm

    User for Mailman mail list wrote:
    Banging my head against the wall ( and it hurts..)

    On the different list from our Mailman mail list server, the mail goes out
    fine except for users with a "verizon.net" address. Here is a typical
    syslog entry:

    Jun 26 12:57:29 secure sm-mta[13001]: k5QJv2Gt012804:
    to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:00, xdelay�:00:00, mailer=esmtp, pri6103,
    relay=relay.verizon.net. [206.46.232.11], dsn=5.0.0, stat=Service unavailable


    But if I send that user an email from that same server (but not from
    Mailman) the log shows:

    Jun 26 14:23:05 secure sendmail[15184]: k5QLN5UB015181:
    to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:00, xdelay�:00:00, mailer=relay, pri0295,
    relay=[127.0.0.1] [127.0.0.1], dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent (k5QLN5kD015185 Message accepted for delivery)

    Jun 26 14:23:12 secure sm-mta[15195]: k5QLN5kD015185: to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:07,
    xdelay�:00:07, mailer=esmtp, pri0469, relay=relay.verizon.net.
    [206.46.232.11], dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent (2.5.0 Ok.)


    I'm at a loss. All the other mail gets delivered properly but not the
    verizon.net mail.
    Verizon doesn't like something in the transaction from Mailman.

    Since it's the same server, we can assume the HELO/EHLO is the same so
    it's either the envelope sender (MAIL FROM command) or something in
    the message data.

    Most likely Verizon doesn't like the envelope sender
    'listname-bounces at list.domain.tld.

    You could try manually sending a normal message with that envelope
    sender and see if it is rejected.

    --
    Mark Sapiro <msapiro at value.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
  • Barry Finkel at Jun 27, 2006 at 3:39 pm

    User for Mailman mail list wrote:

    Banging my head against the wall ( and it hurts..)

    On the different list from our Mailman mail list server, the mail goes out
    fine except for users with a "verizon.net" address. Here is a typical
    syslog entry:

    Jun 26 12:57:29 secure sm-mta[13001]: k5QJv2Gt012804:
    to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:00, xdelay�:00:00, mailer=esmtp, pri6103,
    relay=relay.verizon.net. [206.46.232.11], dsn=5.0.0, stat=Service unavailable


    But if I send that user an email from that same server (but not from
    Mailman) the log shows:

    Jun 26 14:23:05 secure sendmail[15184]: k5QLN5UB015181:
    to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:00, xdelay�:00:00, mailer=relay, pri0295,
    relay=[127.0.0.1] [127.0.0.1], dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent (k5QLN5kD015185 Message accepted for delivery)

    Jun 26 14:23:12 secure sm-mta[15195]: k5QLN5kD015185: to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:07,
    xdelay�:00:07, mailer=esmtp, pri0469, relay=relay.verizon.net.
    [206.46.232.11], dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent (2.5.0 Ok.)


    I'm at a loss. All the other mail gets delivered properly but not the
    verizon.net mail.
    And Mark Sapiro <msapiro at value.net> replied:
    Verizon doesn't like something in the transaction from Mailman.
    I have had problems in the past sending mail to verizon.net. I could
    not even send mail to postmaster at verizon.net. I believe that Verizon
    has some anti-spam filter that does not accept a lot of legitimate mail.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Barry S. Finkel
    Computing and Information Systems Division
    Argonne National Laboratory Phone: +1 (630) 252-7277
    9700 South Cass Avenue Facsimile:+1 (630) 252-4601
    Building 222, Room D209 Internet: BSFinkel at anl.gov
    Argonne, IL 60439-4828 IBMMAIL: I1004994
  • Larry Stone at Jun 27, 2006 at 4:56 pm

    On Tue, 27 Jun 2006, Barry Finkel wrote:

    User for Mailman mail list wrote:
    Banging my head against the wall ( and it hurts..)

    On the different list from our Mailman mail list server, the mail goes out
    fine except for users with a "verizon.net" address. Here is a typical
    syslog entry:

    Jun 26 12:57:29 secure sm-mta[13001]: k5QJv2Gt012804:
    to=<auser at verizon.net>, delay�:00:00, xdelay�:00:00, mailer=esmtp, pri6103,
    relay=relay.verizon.net. [206.46.232.11], dsn=5.0.0, stat=Service unavailable
    I have had problems in the past sending mail to verizon.net. I could
    not even send mail to postmaster at verizon.net. I believe that Verizon
    has some anti-spam filter that does not accept a lot of legitimate mail.
    I've seen the same thing with verizon.net. But even more strange, I'll
    have messages go through to some verizon.net users while the same message
    will not go through for other users (when it happens, it seems to always
    be the same users where it's not going through). Which makes me think some
    users turn on some optional spam checking or similar.

    In addition, I never see a permanent rejection (5xx), just transient
    (4xx). Meaning the silly message sticks around for days until it times
    out. Unfortunately, the list where this happens is in its inactive time of
    the year and all the relevant logs have aged off the system so I can't say
    if the specific error I'm getting is the same "Service Unavailable" in the
    OP's log extract.

    -- Larry Stone
    lstone19 at stonejongleux.com
  • Mark Sapiro at Jun 27, 2006 at 10:51 pm

    Steve Campbell wrote:
    I have almost talked some of our departments into switching to Mailman for a
    few lists they currently maintain from another product. Around here,
    verizon.net is a very popular ISP, so a lot of members use them for email.
    How would I go about requesting a waiver from verizon for some of these
    lists. They only have members who have requested a subscription? Does anyone
    have experience with this?

    I don't know that you will even have a problem. Until we hear from the
    OP as to the resolution of that issue, we don't know that this is a
    systemic Verizon/Mailman issue. It could be, but it could also be the
    sending domain or something else. I know the OP said it only affected
    Mailman mail at his site, but we don't know that list mail there
    doesn't come from a different domain from non list mail for example.

    If I were you, I'd set up a small test list with some cooperative
    Verizon users on it and see if you have a problem.

    If you do have a problem with Verizon accepting your mail, you should
    be able to get whitelisted, but I don't know in detail how to go about
    it.

    --
    Mark Sapiro <msapiro at value.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

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postedJun 26, '06 at 10:55p
activeJun 27, '06 at 10:51p
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