FAQ
I love your mailing list which I configured through Mac OS X sever GUI.

It worked for a couple of days then it stopped working.

In the terminal (which I am not terribly profficient at) I ran -
/usr/share/mailman/bin/mailmanctl -s restart

and got the following:

www2:/Users/mailserver root# /usr/share/mailman/bin/mailmanctl -s
restart
Restarting Mailman's master qrunner
PID unreadable in: /private/var/mailman/data/master-qrunner.pid
[Errno 2] No such file or directory:
'/private/var/mailman/data/master-qrunner.pid'
Is qrunner even running?
www2:/Users/mailserver root#

Also in the OSX mailing list logs I got this:

Mar 15 10:20:59 2005 mailmanctl(1178): PID unreadable in:
/private/var/mailman/data/master-qrunner.pid
Mar 15 10:20:59 2005 mailmanctl(1178): [Errno 2] No such file or
directory: '/private/var/mailman/data/master-qrunner.pid'
Mar 15 10:20:59 2005 mailmanctl(1178): Is qrunner even running?
Mar 15 10:31:46 2005 mailmanctl(1403): The master qrunner lock could
not be acquired. It appears as though there is
a stale master qrunner lock. Try re-running mailmanctl with the -s
flag.
Mar 15 10:31:46 2005 mailmanctl(1403):

I have restarted the server and service. I have recreated the original
mailman from scratch again - still no joy.

Please could you advise?

Thank you - Oliver Dow

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  • Brad Knowles at Mar 16, 2005 at 9:10 am

    At 10:37 AM -0500 2005-03-15, Oliver Dow wrote:

    I love your mailing list which I configured through Mac OS X sever GUI.
    Ahh. Please note that Apple has made a number of modifications
    to that version of Mailman, and they have not shared with us their
    changes. Our ability to support that version of Mailman is greatly
    reduced. Please see
    <http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py?req=show&file=faq01.021.htp>.
    PID unreadable in: /private/var/mailman/data/master-qrunner.pid
    [Errno 2] No such file or directory:
    '/private/var/mailman/data/master-qrunner.pid'
    Is qrunner even running?
    Are you sure the directory path /private/var/mailman/data
    actually exists, and that it has the correct ownership and
    permissions, so that Mailman can write to it? Perhaps you have
    another process somewhere on the system that is accidentally deleting
    some part of this directory hierarchy?
    Mar 15 10:20:59 2005 mailmanctl(1178): PID unreadable in:
    /private/var/mailman/data/master-qrunner.pid
    Mar 15 10:20:59 2005 mailmanctl(1178): [Errno 2] No such file or
    directory: '/private/var/mailman/data/master-qrunner.pid'
    Mar 15 10:20:59 2005 mailmanctl(1178): Is qrunner even running?
    Right, it sent to the log the same information it gave you on the
    command-line.
    I have restarted the server and service. I have recreated the original
    mailman from scratch again - still no joy.
    Short of having you check the path ownership and permissions, and
    look for rogue processes on your system that may be deleting some
    part of the path or changing the ownership or permissions to
    something else, I don't know that we'll be able to provide much help.

    --
    Brad Knowles, <brad at stop.mail-abuse.org>

    "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little
    temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

    -- Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790), reply of the Pennsylvania
    Assembly to the Governor, November 11, 1755

    SAGE member since 1995. See <http://www.sage.org/> for more info.
  • Ian Eiloart at Mar 16, 2005 at 9:52 am

    --On March 16, 2005 10:10:08 +0100 Brad Knowles wrote:

    Ahh. Please note that Apple has made a number of modifications to that
    version of Mailman, and they have not shared with us their changes. Our
    ability to support that version of Mailman is greatly reduced. Please
    see
    <http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py?req=show&file=faq01.021.htp>.
    Really? That would contravene the GNU license, surely? The FAQ says that
    they distribute a binary of the compiled parts, but not the source. They've
    added at least one script "apple_config_list", but that _is_ source code,
    so it _is_ shared.

    The FAQ also says they've created a GUI interface to help edit the config
    file. It doesn't say they've modified Mailman at all.


    --
    Ian Eiloart
    Servers Team
    Sussex University ITS
  • Brad Knowles at Mar 16, 2005 at 9:57 am

    At 9:52 AM +0000 2005-03-16, Ian Eiloart wrote:

    Really? That would contravene the GNU license, surely? The FAQ says that
    they distribute a binary of the compiled parts, but not the source.
    My understanding is that they have made changes to the code.
    They've added at least one script "apple_config_list", but that _is_
    source code, so it _is_ shared.
    Where is it shared? I haven't seen it.
    The FAQ also says they've created a GUI interface to help edit the
    config file. It doesn't say they've modified Mailman at all.
    Well, I wrote most of the original FAQ entry, but it's been a
    while so I'll have to go back and check what it says now.

    --
    Brad Knowles, <brad at stop.mail-abuse.org>

    "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little
    temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

    -- Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790), reply of the Pennsylvania
    Assembly to the Governor, November 11, 1755

    SAGE member since 1995. See <http://www.sage.org/> for more info.
  • Ian Eiloart at Mar 16, 2005 at 10:13 am

    --On March 16, 2005 10:57:08 +0100 Brad Knowles wrote:
    At 9:52 AM +0000 2005-03-16, Ian Eiloart wrote:

    Really? That would contravene the GNU license, surely? The FAQ says that
    they distribute a binary of the compiled parts, but not the source.
    My understanding is that they have made changes to the code.
    They've added at least one script "apple_config_list", but that _is_
    source code, so it _is_ shared.
    Where is it shared? I haven't seen it.
    Well, the GNU license says that they have to share the source with the
    people that they distribute it to. If it's binary code, that means you have
    to distribute the source. If it's python scripts, then the executable code
    _is_ the source. I do see additions to the scripts, and the GUI is also an
    addition. I don't see modifications, though.

    One thing I can't tell is what version they've distributed. Is there a way
    to query the Mailman version from the command line?

    Anyway, it would have been good for Apple to submit their changes to
    Mailman. I'm just trying to figure out whether they've contravened the GNU
    license. If they've changed the source for the compiled parts, then they
    may well have.

    The FAQ also says they've created a GUI interface to help edit the
    config file. It doesn't say they've modified Mailman at all.
    Well, I wrote most of the original FAQ entry, but it's been a while so
    I'll have to go back and check what it says now.


    --
    Ian Eiloart
    Servers Team
    Sussex University ITS
  • Brad Knowles at Mar 16, 2005 at 7:30 pm

    At 10:13 AM +0000 2005-03-16, Ian Eiloart wrote:

    Well, the GNU license says that they have to share the source with the
    people that they distribute it to. If it's binary code, that means you
    have to distribute the source. If it's python scripts, then the
    executable code _is_ the source. I do see additions to the scripts, and
    the GUI is also an addition. I don't see modifications, though.
    If they've made changes to the Python code, then they're covered.
    Other than the scripts and the Python code, I don't think that there
    are any "binaries" that we ship.
    One thing I can't tell is what version they've distributed.
    Reliable sources have informed me that it is 2.1.2.
    Is there a
    way to query the Mailman version from the command line?
    Good question. I don't know.
    Anyway, it would have been good for Apple to submit their changes to
    Mailman.
    That's certainly what we would have preferred. I've tried
    contacting the appropriate people at Apple, and they have never
    responded.

    The word that I have from other people at Apple that I have
    talked to is that the group responsible for doing OSX Server
    development doesn't care about any support issues, and they are just
    as unresponsive to internal Apple people as they are to outsiders.
    And even less responsive to Apple customers. ;(
    I'm just trying to figure out whether they've contravened
    the GNU license. If they've changed the source for the compiled parts,
    then they may well have.
    Do we ship any compiled parts?

    --
    Brad Knowles, <brad at stop.mail-abuse.org>

    "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little
    temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

    -- Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790), reply of the Pennsylvania
    Assembly to the Governor, November 11, 1755

    SAGE member since 1995. See <http://www.sage.org/> for more info.
  • Dan Phillips at Mar 16, 2005 at 7:59 pm

    On Mar 16, 2005, at 1:30 PM, Brad Knowles wrote:
    At 10:13 AM +0000 2005-03-16, Ian Eiloart wrote:
    Is there a way to query the Mailman version from the command line?
    Good question. I don't know.
    bin/version :-)

    Dan

    ================================
    Dan Phillips
    Professor of Horn, University of Memphis
    webmaster: http://music.memphis.edu
  • Ian Eiloart at Mar 17, 2005 at 1:09 pm
    --On Wednesday, March 16, 2005 1:59 pm -0600 Dan Phillips
    wrote:
    On Mar 16, 2005, at 1:30 PM, Brad Knowles wrote:
    At 10:13 AM +0000 2005-03-16, Ian Eiloart wrote:
    Is there a way to query the Mailman version from the command line?
    Good question. I don't know.
    bin/version :-)

    Dan
    doh!

    So, yes 2.1.2 is the current version on MacOSX 10.3:

    [chip:/usr/share/mailman] iane% bin/version
    Using Mailman version: 2.1.2


    --
    Ian Eiloart
    Servers Team
    Sussex University ITS
  • Mark Sapiro at Mar 16, 2005 at 8:05 pm

    Brad Knowles wrote:
    Do we ship any compiled parts?
    We ship C language source for the wrappers in cgi-bin/ and mail/

    --
    Mark Sapiro <msapiro at value.net> The highway is for gamblers,
    San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

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