FAQ
Oh, and perhaps one other piece of advice I personally would pass along to
junior DBAs...

Start using sql*plus as much as you can, and write your own set of scripts
for it. Because in doing so you will learn a lot that you would never learn
simply by clicking GUI buttons or by using some other scripts downloaded
over the internet.

What are you going to do if that GUI tool doesn't show you the data in a way
you need it? If you've written the scripts yourself you implicitly gain
knowledge about the source of the data you're looking at. Where it comes
from, what it's linked to, how consistent it is, what it really means, etc.
And it will be easy to present the data in another way, as you have a much
better understanding of the data you're looking at.

Stefan

Stefan P Knecht
CEO & Founder
s_at_10046.ch

10046 Consulting GmbH
Schwarzackerstrasse 29
CH-8304 Wallisellen
Switzerland

Phone +41-(0)8400-10046
Cell +41 (0) 79 571 36 27
info_at_10046.ch
http://www.10046.ch

On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 4:09 AM, Aragon, Gabriel (GE, Corporate, consultant)
wrote:
Hi list,

I have been asked to give a sqlplus training to some junior and junior+
DBA's, since Im expecting the first question to be:

"I know how to run most common DML/DDL/etc commands so, why do I need to
take a sqlplus training to format output or generate reports when there is a
lot of tools which can help me to access database w/o using manual input?"

and I have thought some answers like:

1. Im sure nobody is exploding all features available in SQLPLUS.
2. What would you do if you have to work in a company which is not able to
pay for nice tools?
3. Knowledge on SQLPLUS would help you to get a better understanding of
oracle database.

and so on..

but I would like to hear some feedback from you guys, why a sqlplus
training is important?

TIA
Gabriel


--
http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l

Search Discussions

  • Gints Plivna at Dec 23, 2010 at 8:43 am
    As I'm developer and not DBA, I can also follow previous argument of
    SQL*Plus which is everywhere. Yes mostly now I'm using PL/SQL
    Developer in my organization, but I'm trying not to forget SQL*Plus
    because:
    1) There were cases when I had to be on a client's site without PL/SQL
    Developer, Toad or whatever else GUI tool. Rare cases but at least a
    few. For example recently our consultant DBA installed Oracle for a
    client, I could login through VPN, Putty or whatever these tools where
    :) and access next production Oracle only via SQL*Plus.
    2) all installations for our developed App Oracle code are as SQL*Plus
    scripts. Easy configurable, runs on Linux, AIX, Windows whatver OS
    wher Oracle server for our apps are installed.
    3) thanks to SQL*Plus I know at least basic syntax for create table,
    constraint, index (and probably something more) as well as alter, drop
    etc. So in case of emergency I don't need to look in docs for basic
    things.
    4) SQL*Plus scripts and their results are very cool for demonstrations
    - easy to show both used statements and results of the statement.

    Gints Plivna
    http://www.gplivna.eu

    2010/12/23 Aragon, Gabriel (GE, Corporate, consultant) :
    Hi list,

    I have been asked to give a sqlplus training to some junior and junior+
    DBA's, since Im expecting the first question to be:

    "I know how to run most common DML/DDL/etc commands so, why do I need to
    take a sqlplus training to format output or generate reports when there is a
    lot of tools which can help me to access database w/o using manual input?"

    and I have thought some answers like:

    1. Im sure nobody is exploding all features available in SQLPLUS.
    2. What would you do if you have to work in a company which is not able to
    pay for nice tools?
    3. Knowledge on SQLPLUS would help you to get a better understanding of
    oracle database.

    and so on..

    but I would like to hear some feedback from you guys, why a sqlplus training
    is important?

    TIA
    Gabriel

    --
    http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l
  • OKH at Dec 23, 2010 at 9:07 am
    Hi

    U*nix guys don't ask why to use shell.

    sqlplus is not only a command line interface but also "glue" for programming scripts and concatenating steps. you can bring in interactivity and error handling, etc. It is like shell programming. Most of the "script"-features are not available in GUI tools. And like others already mentioned, you can use it wherever you go. As a freelancer you cannot count on tools - just SQL*plus. Take a look at Tanel Poders script library ... at all his snapper-tool. Probably you can convince them with its outstanding way how he programmer it.

    Merry Christmas

    Felix

    Am 23.12.2010 um 04:09 schrieb "Aragon, Gabriel (GE, Corporate, consultant)" :
    Hi list,

    I have been asked to give a sqlplus training to some junior and junior+ DBA's, since Im expecting the first question to be:

    "I know how to run most common DML/DDL/etc commands so, why do I need to take a sqlplus training to format output or generate reports when there is a lot of tools which can help me to access database w/o using manual input?"

    and I have thought some answers like:

    1. Im sure nobody is exploding all features available in SQLPLUS.
    2. What would you do if you have to work in a company which is not able to pay for nice tool
    3. Knowledge on SQLPLUS would help you to get a better understanding of oracle database.

    and so on..

    but I would like to hear some feedback from you guys, why a sqlplus training is important?

    TIA
    Gabriel

    --
    http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l
  • Andrew Kerber at Dec 23, 2010 at 1:56 pm
    At its most basic, the answer is that if you use tools instead of sqlplus,
    you lean how but you never learn why.
    On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 3:07 AM, OKH wrote:

    Hi

    U*nix guys don't ask why to use shell.

    sqlplus is not only a command line interface but also "glue" for
    programming scripts and concatenating steps. you can bring in interactivity
    and error handling, etc. It is like shell programming. Most of the
    "script"-features are not available in GUI tools. And like others already
    mentioned, you can use it wherever you go. As a freelancer you cannot count
    on tools - just SQL*plus. Take a look at Tanel Poders script library ... at
    all his snapper-tool. Probably you can convince them with its outstanding
    way how he programmer it.

    Merry Christmas



    Felix

    Am 23.12.2010 um 04:09 schrieb "Aragon, Gabriel (GE, Corporate,
    consultant)" :

    Hi list,

    I have been asked to give a sqlplus training to some junior and junior+
    DBA's, since Im expecting the first question to be:

    "I know how to run most common DML/DDL/etc commands so, why do I need to
    take a sqlplus training to format output or generate reports when there is a
    lot of tools which can help me to access database w/o using manual input?"

    and I have thought some answers like:

    1. Im sure nobody is exploding all features available in SQLPLUS.
    2. What would you do if you have to work in a company which is not able to
    pay for nice tool
    3. Knowledge on SQLPLUS would help you to get a better understanding of
    oracle database.

    and so on..

    but I would like to hear some feedback from you guys, why a sqlplus
    training is important?

    TIA
    Gabriel



    --
    Andrew W. Kerber

    'If at first you dont succeed, dont take up skydiving.'

    --
    http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l
  • Guillermo Alan Bort at Dec 23, 2010 at 3:08 pm
    In a training session my approach would be somewhat different.

    ask the attendees:

    1. What do you think SQL*Plus is?
    2. What can you do with SQL*Plus?
    3. What tools do you currently use for your day-to-day tasks?
    4. Do you think that knowing SQL*Plus would in some way improve your

    productivity? <--- or perhaps: do you think that knowing SQL*Plus would
    allow you to do things faster and give you time to check facebook?

    After you get a few answers, take them and shape them into an argument FOR
    sql*plus. And specially after the first two questions, take a few minutes to
    demonstrate what YOU can do with sql*plus (some quick formatting, perhaps
    something in the login.sql file as well) and show them how with very few
    lines you can transform the ugly output into something you could even paste
    into a presentation for Management.

    I have taught my fair share of oracle trainings, and have found the best
    results when I adapted the contents somewhat to the audience. Granted, as a
    OU trainer you can't change the contents of a course, but you can emphasize
    one more than the other, take more time for a given chapter and then
    fast-forward through another.

    HTH

    Alan.-
    On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 10:56 AM, Andrew Kerber wrote:

    At its most basic, the answer is that if you use tools instead of sqlplus,
    you lean how but you never learn why.

    On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 3:07 AM, OKH wrote:

    Hi

    U*nix guys don't ask why to use shell.

    sqlplus is not only a command line interface but also "glue" for
    programming scripts and concatenating steps. you can bring in interactivity
    and error handling, etc. It is like shell programming. Most of the
    "script"-features are not available in GUI tools. And like others already
    mentioned, you can use it wherever you go. As a freelancer you cannot count
    on tools - just SQL*plus. Take a look at Tanel Poders script library ... at
    all his snapper-tool. Probably you can convince them with its outstanding
    way how he programmer it.

    Merry Christmas



    Felix

    Am 23.12.2010 um 04:09 schrieb "Aragon, Gabriel (GE, Corporate,
    consultant)" :

    Hi list,

    I have been asked to give a sqlplus training to some junior and junior+
    DBA's, since Im expecting the first question to be:

    "I know how to run most common DML/DDL/etc commands so, why do I need to
    take a sqlplus training to format output or generate reports when there is a
    lot of tools which can help me to access database w/o using manual input?"

    and I have thought some answers like:

    1. Im sure nobody is exploding all features available in SQLPLUS.
    2. What would you do if you have to work in a company which is not able to
    pay for nice tool
    3. Knowledge on SQLPLUS would help you to get a better understanding of
    oracle database.

    and so on..

    but I would like to hear some feedback from you guys, why a sqlplus
    training is important?

    TIA
    Gabriel




    --
    Andrew W. Kerber

    'If at first you dont succeed, dont take up skydiving.'
    --
    http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l
  • Anonymous at Dec 23, 2010 at 4:44 pm
    I found out that this reason is VERY true in large, security conscious
    companies:

    There's many environments where connections to the database via
    GUI-Tools are disallowed. You are forced to use sql*plus

    From: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org
    On Behalf Of Stefan Knecht
    Sent: Thursday, December 23, 2010 2:08 AM
    To: gabriel.aragon_at_ge.com
    Cc: oracle-l-freelists
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?



    In my opionion, with some random early-morning thoughts,



    Because it's simply the fastest and most efficient tool to diagnose
    any Oracle problems the "SQL-way" - if you've got your set of scripts
    you'll get to the information you need a 100 times faster than anyone
    can click through toad or - particularly - GC.

    There's many environments where connections to the database via
    GUI-Tools are disallowed. You are forced to use sql*plus

    It doesn't need windows (that's my favourite reason!) and it's just
    plain sexy :-)

    If you have a login file with the most commonly used columns
    pre-formatted (and things like linesize, pagesize et al) - it makes
    using the tool even more efficient.

    And most of all,



    there's nothing more embarassing for a DBA that he's unable to do his
    job when toad breaks or grid control dies while you're having an issue,
    and you're not able to use sql*plus properly. Even if you're not using
    it all the time, it helps knowing the command syntax (that is hidden
    beyond fancy buttons in those tools) - as knowing and understanding that
    syntax implicitly brings knowledge about what's happening under the
    cover when you execute said command.

    Stefan



    Stefan P Knecht
    CEO & Founder
    s_at_10046.ch

    10046 Consulting GmbH
    Schwarzackerstrasse 29
    CH-8304 Wallisellen
    Switzerland

    Phone +41-(0)8400-10046
    Cell +41 (0) 79 571 36 27
    info_at_10046.ch
    http://www.10046.ch

    On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 4:09 AM, Aragon, Gabriel (GE, Corporate,
    consultant) wrote:

    Hi list,



    I have been asked to give a sqlplus training to some junior and junior+
    DBA's, since Im expecting the first question to be:



    "I know how to run most common DML/DDL/etc commands so, why do I need to
    take a sqlplus training to format output or generate reports when there
    is a lot of tools which can help me to access database w/o using manual
    input?"



    and I have thought some answers like:



    Im sure nobody is exploding all features available in SQLPLUS.

    What would you do if you have to work in a company which is not able
    to pay for nice tools?

    Knowledge on SQLPLUS would help you to get a better understanding of
    oracle database.

    and so on..



    but I would like to hear some feedback from you guys, why a sqlplus
    training is important?



    TIA

    Gabriel
  • Goulet, Richard at Dec 27, 2010 at 6:58 pm
    One thing I've seen way to many times and with too much anguish
    thereafter, is people forgetting where they are logged into, especially
    when using multiple SQL*Plus sessions. I've preached and preached tuill
    I'm blue in the face about changing the sql prompt (a SQL*Plus thing) to
    tell you what database and user your logged into. It's so darn simple,
    prevents so many mistakes, and yet too many folks don't like doing this.
    In the login.sql file set:


    break on server_name on user
    column global_name noprint new_value _sn
    column user noprint new_value _usser
    select nvl(substr(global_name,1,instr(global_name,'.',1)-1),
    global_name) as global_name, user
    from global_name;
    set verify off
    set sqlprompt '&_sn:&_usser>'


    Now at least if you look you'll see when your on the production db and
    the master schema before you run that drop everything script that was
    needed on development.


    Dick Goulet
    Senior Oracle DBA



    From: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org
    On Behalf Of coskan_at_gmail.com
    Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 1:12 PM
    Cc: Oracle L
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    If I do the same course I would only say you will need it when there is
    cto cio csomething behind you while your db is in trouble and not
    accessable via gui. Apart from that it is always about speed and
    reliability. I saw oem running like a dog which is impossible to work
    on, I saw toad crash in the middle of my work however I never saw
    sqlplus very slow or died unexpectedly (even on windows client which is
    miracle)

    Also show them the output of login script of tanel poder and if they
    don't like it then there is nothing you can do :)

    From: Jared Still
    Sender: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org
    Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2010 09:25:09 -0800
    To:
    ReplyTo: jkstill_at_gmail.com
    Cc:;
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 8:10 AM, wrote:

    How about, because you can't always do things via the GUI. Take
    for example if you only ever do things thru OEM and its down, now what?
    You mean you can't resize a datafile via an alter database command,
    you're a GUI DBA? :)



    Also known as DBA 2.0

    Jared Still
    Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist
    Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com
    Home Page: http://jaredstill.com
  • Taylor, Chris David at Dec 27, 2010 at 7:24 pm
    I'm not sure how anyone could put "Sr." in their dba title until they've done that at least once;) Logging into the wrong database and causing anguish and gnashing of teeth that is...

    Chris

    From: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org On Behalf Of Goulet, Richard
    Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 12:58 PM
    To: coskan_at_gmail.com
    Cc: Oracle L
    Subject: RE: SQLPLUS training, why?

    One thing I've seen way to many times and with too much anguish thereafter, is people forgetting where they are logged into, especially when using multiple SQL*Plus sessions. I've preached and preached tuill I'm blue in the face about changing the sql prompt (a SQL*Plus thing) to tell you what database and user your logged into. It's so darn simple, prevents so many mistakes, and yet too many folks don't like doing this. In the login.sql file set:

    break on server_name on user
    column global_name noprint new_value _sn
    column user noprint new_value _usser
    select nvl(substr(global_name,1,instr(global_name,'.',1)-1), global_name) as global_name, user
    from global_name;
    set verify off
    set sqlprompt '&_sn:&_usser>'

    Now at least if you look you'll see when your on the production db and the master schema before you run that drop everything script that was needed on development.

    Dick Goulet
    Senior Oracle DBA

    From: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org On Behalf Of coskan_at_gmail.com
    Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 1:12 PM
    Cc: Oracle L
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?
    If I do the same course I would only say you will need it when there is cto cio csomething behind you while your db is in trouble and not accessable via gui. Apart from that it is always about speed and reliability. I saw oem running like a dog which is impossible to work on, I saw toad crash in the middle of my work however I never saw sqlplus very slow or died unexpectedly (even on windows client which is miracle)

    Also show them the output of login script of tanel poder and if they don't like it then there is nothing you can do :)

    From: Jared Still
    Sender: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org
    Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2010 09:25:09 -0800
    To:
    ReplyTo: jkstill_at_gmail.com
    Cc:;
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 8:10 AM, > wrote:

    How about, because you can't always do things via the GUI. Take for example if you only ever do things thru OEM and its down, now what? You mean you can't resize a datafile via an alter database command, you're a GUI DBA? :)

    Also known as DBA 2.0

    Jared Still
    Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist
    Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com
    Home Page: http://jaredstill.com
  • Jacques Kilchoer at Dec 27, 2010 at 8:09 pm
    People seem to be talking about two different things here.
    You definitely need to know the basis of Oracle SQL as mentioned in the SQL Reference manual.
    http://download.oracle.com/docs/cd/E11882_01/server.112/e17118/toc.htm
    A DBA should know how to type in the commands related to database administration, e.g. alter system, create tablespace, alter tablespace, create table, alter table, create index, alter index, etc. etc. And know where to go look if he doesn't remember the exact syntax to create a tablespace.

    The question originally asked, as it seems to me, is this: does an Oracle DBA need to know the SQL*Plus specific commands that you would use to create SQL*Plus reports, do variable substitution in SQL*Plus, etc? Does a DBA need to know what is in the SQL*Plus manual?
    http://download.oracle.com/docs/cd/E11882_01/server.112/e16604/toc.htm

    I vote yes, but how important is it to a DBA to know the SQL*Plus specific commands?
  • Jared Still at Dec 27, 2010 at 9:15 pm

    On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 12:09 PM, Jacques Kilchoer < Jacques.Kilchoer_at_quest.com> wrote:


    I vote yes, but how important is it to a DBA to know the SQL*Plus specific
    commands?
    Only important if you want to format reports so they are readable.

    ... or spool to .csv
    ... or accept input from the operator
    ... or declare defined/bind variables and use them to set the value of

    PL/SQL variables

    I sure many here can add to that list.

    Jared Still
    Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist
    Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com
    Home Page: http://jaredstill.com
  • Goulet, Richard at Dec 27, 2010 at 7:01 pm
    Humm, forgot about PL/SQL. Could not live a day without it. Remember
    when we use to use sql to create sql command files? Well, same thing
    works, a lot better, through an anonymous pl/sql block.


    Dick Goulet
    Senior Oracle DBA



    From: Don Seiler
    Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 12:03 PM
    To: Goulet, Richard
    Cc: Taylor, Chris David; gabriel.aragon_at_ge.com; oracle-l@freelists.org
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    When I started my new job 2 years ago, I made it a point to use sqlplus
    for everything that I could, to break my dependency on TOAD and TORA and
    the like. I've learned so much doing so, it's the best decision I've
    ever made. Learning about the important V$ views to query for different
    problems, rather than seeing only what a specific GUI screen will show
    you, learning PL/SQL, etc. Plus formatting etc, I would definitely
    recommend using sqlplus for automated reports as much as possible.

    Don.

    On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Goulet, Richard
    wrote:

    Chris,


    Well, I suppose that term really does need definition
    because it really does change by what your doing. Yes I do learn
    something new about SQL just about daily, especially with the
    duhvelopers we have around here. There are quite a few who should enter
    the "Obfuscated SQL" contest. Had a "problem" sql statement handed to
    me the other day. 157 lines of code, 8 sub queries, 12 dynamic view
    definitions, and 2 partition by clauses only to find what the
    max(last_trial_date) was in a particular table for a particular trial.
    And to boot the script had a number of defines, breaks, new_column and
    no print statements included. Boy was that ever fun???


    So back to the original question, mastery to me means that
    you can read 90% of the sql your handed and make sense out of it and
    that you can repair, create, or diagnose a database without the help of
    a GUI because you may not have access to one. For the remainder I'd
    expect the individual to have a good understanding of where in the
    documentation he/she can find what they need and understand it. Why the
    docs you say. because you may or may not have access to the net when you
    most need it. Many years ago I was faced with a broken database, a
    VT100 terminal directly attached to the server, an no external network
    connectivity. Thank GOD for Palm Pilots.


    Dick Goulet
    Senior Oracle DBA

    ________________________________

    From: Taylor, Chris David

    Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 11:28 AM
    To: Goulet, Richard; 'gabriel.aragon_at_ge.com';

    'oracle-l@freelists.org'

    Subject: RE: SQLPLUS training, why?


    What is considered "mastery"?



    I think I learn something new fairly regularly using sqlplus J



    Heck, I think I "re-learn" something I've forgotten pretty often
    as well. I'm glad there's Google or Bing or Metalink or any number of
    other sites that I can quickly look up syntax when I need it.



    I'm pretty good with sql but I am still often amazed how
    powerful it is and how little I really "know".



    Chris Taylor

    Sr. Oracle DBA

    Ingram Barge Company

    Nashville, TN 37205

    Office: 615-517-3355

    Cell: 615-663-1673

    Email: chris.taylor_at_ingrambarge.com



    CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail and any attachments are
    confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the named
    recipient, please notify the sender immediately and delete the contents
    of this message without disclosing the contents to anyone, using them
    for any purpose, or storing or copying the information on any medium.



    From: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org
    On Behalf Of Goulet, Richard

    Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 10:05 AM
    To: gabriel.aragon_at_ge.com; oracle-l@freelists.org
    Subject: RE: SQLPLUS training, why?

    Gabriel,

    My first question on this would be something like "Why don't

    they already have a mastery of SQL*Plus and SQL?". I'd think that that
    would be a pre-req for being able to work as a DBA in the first place.
    But assuming that they don't have that mastery then the more you know
    about what your managing and using, the better you are at it.



    Dick Goulet
    Senior Oracle DBA

    ________________________________

    From: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org

    On Behalf Of Aragon, Gabriel (GE,
    Corporate, consultant)

    Sent: Wednesday, December 22, 2010 10:09 PM
    To: oracle-l@freelists.org
    Subject: SQLPLUS training, why?

    Hi list,

    I have been asked to give a sqlplus training to some junior and

    junior+ DBA's, since Im expecting the first question to be:



    "I know how to run most common DML/DDL/etc commands so, why do I
    need to take a sqlplus training to format output or generate reports
    when there is a lot of tools which can help me to access database w/o
    using manual input?"



    and I have thought some answers like:



    Im sure nobody is exploding all features available in
    SQLPLUS.

    What would you do if you have to work in a company which is
    not able to pay for nice tools?

    Knowledge on SQLPLUS would help you to get a better
    understanding of oracle database.

    and so on..



    but I would like to hear some feedback from you guys, why a
    sqlplus training is important?



    TIA

    Gabriel
  • TESTAJ3_at_nationwide.com at Dec 28, 2010 at 1:24 pm
    :1,$ s/old_string/new_string/ <--- REs are your friend :)

    joe

    Joe Testa, Oracle Certified Professional
    Senior Engineering & Administration Lead
    (Work) 614-677-1668
    (Cell) 614-312-6715

    From:
    "Taylor, Chris David"
    To:
    "'kjped1313_at_yahoo.com'",
    "'daniel.fink_at_optimaldba.com'", 'Oracle L'

    Date:
    12/28/2010 08:05 AM
    Subject:
    RE: SQLPLUS training, why?
    Sent by:
    oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org

    I prefer vim (or gvim if I’m in windows) to screw up my statements…
    ;)


    Chris



    From: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org
    On Behalf Of Kellyn Pedersen
    Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 7:05 PM
    To: daniel.fink_at_optimaldba.com; Oracle L
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?


    Although I think I've missed 90% of this thread due to how busy I am,
    Dan's last choice is one I think is really valuable to those taking a SQL
    Plus class and I'll just take it just one step further-
    - Learning how to generate dynamic sql, no matter if it's ddl or dml.

    If I see one more person in MS Word or Wordpad using the replace option
    and screwing up statements. It's just painful to watch... :D


    Kellyn Pedersen
    Sr. Database Administrator
    http://www.linkedin.com/in/kellynpedersen
    www.dbakevlar.com




    From: Daniel W. Fink
    To: Oracle L
    Sent: Mon, December 27, 2010 2:25:24 PM
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    Diagnose issues with Oracle supplied scripts
    Modify/customize Oracle supplied scripts (such as statspack/awr/ash
    reporting)
    Create a basic interactive menu
    Generate ddl (with or without dbms_metadata)

    On 12/27/2010 2:15 PM, Jared Still wrote:
    On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 12:09 PM, Jacques Kilchoer <
    Jacques.Kilchoer_at_quest.com> wrote:


    I vote yes, but how important is it to a DBA to know the SQL*Plus specific
    commands?


    Only important if you want to format reports so they are readable.


    ... or spool to .csv
    ... or accept input from the operator
    ... or declare defined/bind variables and use them to set the value of

    PL/SQL variables


    I sure many here can add to that list.


    Jared Still
    Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist
    Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com
    Home Page: http://jaredstill.com




    No virus found in this incoming message.
    Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
    Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3342 - Release Date: 12/27/10
    00:34:00
  • Stephane Faroult at Dec 28, 2010 at 2:07 pm
    But I think that Kellyn's point was that improper use of regular
    expressions is the source of many clbuttic errors ...

    Stephane Faroult
    RoughSea Ltd <http://www.roughsea.com>
    Konagora <http://www.konagora.com>
    RoughSea Channel on Youtube <http://www.youtube.com/user/roughsealtd>
    On 12/28/2010 02:24 PM, TESTAJ3_at_nationwide.com wrote:

    :1,$ s/old_string/new_string/ <--- REs are your friend :)

    joe

    _______________________________________
    Joe Testa, Oracle Certified Professional
    Senior Engineering & Administration Lead
    (Work) 614-677-1668
    (Cell) 614-312-6715





    From: "Taylor, Chris David"
    To: "'kjped1313_at_yahoo.com'",
    "'daniel.fink_at_optimaldba.com'", 'Oracle
    L'
    Date: 12/28/2010 08:05 AM
    Subject: RE: SQLPLUS training, why?
    Sent by: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org


    ------------------------------------------------------------------------



    I prefer vim (or gvim if I’m in windows) to screw up my statements…

    ;)

    Chris


    *From:* oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org
    *On Behalf Of *Kellyn Pedersen*
    Sent:* Monday, December 27, 2010 7:05 PM*
    To:* daniel.fink_at_optimaldba.com; Oracle L*
    Subject:* Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    Although I think I've missed 90% of this thread due to how busy I am,
    Dan's last choice is one I think is really valuable to those taking a
    SQL Plus class and I'll just take it just one step further-
    - Learning how to generate dynamic sql, no matter if it's ddl or dml.

    If I see one more person in MS Word or Wordpad using the replace
    option and screwing up statements. It's just painful to watch... :D


    Kellyn Pedersen

    Sr. Database Administrator

    _http://www.linkedin.com/in/kellynpedersen_

    _www.dbakevlar.com_ <http://www.dbakevlar.blogspot.com/>






    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    *From:* Daniel W. Fink *
    To:* Oracle L *
    Sent:* Mon, December 27, 2010 2:25:24 PM*
    Subject:* Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    Diagnose issues with Oracle supplied scripts
    Modify/customize Oracle supplied scripts (such as statspack/awr/ash
    reporting)
    Create a basic interactive menu
    Generate ddl (with or without dbms_metadata)


    On 12/27/2010 2:15 PM, Jared Still wrote:
    On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 12:09 PM, Jacques Kilchoer
    wrote:
    I vote yes, but how important is it to a DBA to know the SQL*Plus
    specific commands?

    Only important if you want to format reports so they are readable.

    ... or spool to .csv
    ... or accept input from the operator
    ... or declare defined/bind variables and use them to set the value of
    PL/SQL variables

    I sure many here can add to that list.

    Jared Still
    Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist
    Oracle Blog: _http://jkstill.blogspot.com_ <http://jkstill.blogspot.com/>
    Home Page: _http://jaredstill.com_ <http://jaredstill.com/>



    No virus found in this incoming message.
    Checked by AVG - _www.avg.com_ <http://www.avg.com/>
    Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3342 - Release Date:
    12/27/10 00:34:00
    --
    http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l
  • Kellyn Pedersen at Dec 28, 2010 at 3:10 pm
    Yes and then some... considering the technical level of many who will be
    attending, do you really want them playing around with regular expressions?? I
    was referring to ones who might use MSWord, Text editors and Excel spreadsheets
    to create SQL that could be easily generated inside SQL Plus. When I picture
    these folks, I would never consider just throwing them into the deep end of the
    pool with RE's and say, "Swim!" :)

    Kellyn Pedersen
    Sr. Database Administrator
    http://www.linkedin.com/in/kellynpedersen
    www.dbakevlar.com

    ________________________________
    From: Stephane Faroult
    To: oracle-l@freelists.org
    Sent: Tue, December 28, 2010 7:07:11 AM
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    But I think that Kellyn's point was that improper use of regular expressions is
    the source of many clbuttic errors ...

    Stephane Faroult
    RoughSea Ltd
    Konagora
    RoughSea Channel on Youtube
    On 12/28/2010 02:24 PM, TESTAJ3_at_nationwide.com wrote:

    :1,$ s/old_string/new_string/ <--- REs are your friend :)

    joe

    _______________________________________
    Joe Testa, Oracle Certified Professional
    Senior Engineering & Administration Lead
    (Work)
    614-677-1668begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 614-677-1668 end_of_the_skype_highlighting

    (Cell)
    614-312-6715begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 614-312-6715 end_of_the_skype_highlighting







    From: "Taylor, Chris David"
    To: "'kjped1313_at_yahoo.com'",
    "'daniel.fink_at_optimaldba.com'", 'Oracle L'


    Date: 12/28/2010 08:05 AM
    Subject: RE: SQLPLUS training, why?
    Sent by: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org
    ________________________________

    I prefer vim (or gvim if I’m in windows) to screw up my statements…

    ;)

    Chris


    From: oracle-l-bounce_at_freelists.org On
    Behalf Of Kellyn Pedersen
    Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 7:05 PM
    To: daniel.fink_at_optimaldba.com; Oracle L
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    Although I think I've missed 90% of this thread due to how busy I am, Dan's last
    choice is one I think is really valuable to those taking a SQL Plus class and
    I'll just take it just one step further-
    - Learning how to generate dynamic sql, no matter if it's ddl or dml.

    If I see one more person in MS Word or Wordpad using the replace option and
    screwing up statements. It's just painful to watch... :D


    Kellyn Pedersen
    Sr. Database Administrator
    http://www.linkedin.com/in/kellynpedersen
    www.dbakevlar.com




    ________________________________
    From: Daniel W. Fink
    To: Oracle L
    Sent: Mon, December 27, 2010 2:25:24 PM
    Subject: Re: SQLPLUS training, why?

    Diagnose issues with Oracle supplied scripts
    Modify/customize Oracle supplied scripts (such as statspack/awr/ash reporting)
    Create a basic interactive menu
    Generate ddl (with or without dbms_metadata)


    On 12/27/2010 2:15 PM, Jared Still wrote:
    On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 12:09 PM, Jacques Kilchoer
    wrote:


    I vote yes, but how important is it to a DBA to know the SQL*Plus specific
    commands?


    Only important if you want to format reports so they are readable.

    ... or spool to .csv
    ... or accept input from the operator
    ... or declare defined/bind variables and use them to set the value of PL/SQL
    variables


    I sure many here can add to that list.

    Jared Still
    Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist
    Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com
    Home Page: http://jaredstill.com



    No virus found in this incoming message.
    Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
    Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3342 - Release Date: 12/27/10
    00:34:00


    --
    http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l
  • Nuno Souto at Dec 29, 2010 at 8:38 am

    Kellyn Pedersen wrote,on my timestamp of 29/12/2010 2:10 AM:

    Yes and then some... considering the technical level of many who will be
    attending, do you really want them playing around with regular expressions?? I
    was referring to ones who might use MSWord, Text editors and Excel spreadsheets
    to create SQL that could be easily generated inside SQL Plus. When I picture
    these folks, I would never consider just throwing them into the deep end of the
    pool with RE's and say, "Swim!" :)
    If there is one thing that drives me nuts with that mob - and the
    Toad/sqldeveloper one as well - it's the blank lines in between a single SQL
    statement: guaranteed to screw up a long script when run from SQL*Plus...

    I now run a vim macro through every script originating from that stable!

    --
    Cheers
    Nuno Souto
    in sunny Sydney, Australia
    dbvision_at_iinet.net.au
    --
    http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l
  • Anonymous at Dec 30, 2010 at 2:09 pm
    And the answer (to Nuno's query) appears to be, yes!

    The following has been _at_'d (started) with sqlbl on and off and both
    times, it worked as expected:

    declare

    vDummy varchar2(100);

    begin

    select 'Hello World!'

    into vDummy
    from

    dual;

    dbms_output.put_line(vDummy);
    end;
    /

    I have also pasted it directly into sqlplus with sqlbl on and off, and
    again, both times, it worked as expected.

    The following was not so lucky:

    select 'Hello World!'



    from

    dual;


    Starting (_at_) the file with sqlbl on, the result is as expected and with
    it off, the errors are:

    SP2-0042: unknown command "from" - rest of line ignored.
    SP2-0042: unknown command "dual" - rest of line ignored.

    Pasting the code directly into sqlplus gives the same results.

    Cheers,
    Norm.

    Norman Dunbar
    Contract Senior Oracle DBA
    Capgemini Database Team (EA)
    Internal : 7 28 2051
    External : 0113 231 2051

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  • Nuno Souto at Dec 31, 2010 at 3:23 am
    Thanks Norman. Yup, that's what I was asking, I wasn't very clear in my reply.
    Dang, I need to get Oracle into the new lappie urgently: millions of new things
    to try out. When I'm using the work servers it's usually too hectic to do any
    play around.

    Happy 2011 everyone, while I'm here.

    --
    Cheers
    Nuno Souto
    in sunny Sydney, Australia
    dbvision_at_iinet.net.au

    Dunbar, Norman (Capgemini) wrote,on my timestamp of 31/12/2010 1:09 AM:
    And the answer (to Nuno's query) appears to be, yes!

    The following has been _at_'d (started) with sqlbl on and off and both
    times, it worked as expected:

    declare
    vDummy varchar2(100);

    begin
    select 'Hello World!'

    into vDummy
    from


    dual;

    dbms_output.put_line(vDummy);
    end;
    /

    I have also pasted it directly into sqlplus with sqlbl on and off, and
    again, both times, it worked as expected.

    The following was not so lucky:

    select 'Hello World!'


    from


    dual;

    Starting (_at_) the file with sqlbl on, the result is as expected and with
    it off, the errors are:

    SP2-0042: unknown command "from" - rest of line ignored.
    SP2-0042: unknown command "dual" - rest of line ignored.

    Pasting the code directly into sqlplus gives the same results.
    --
    http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l

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