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R Lists06 RE: [CentOS] Re: Anaconda doesn't support raid10

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> NCQ SATA is almost a no-brainer.

Feizhou,

It is only a no brainer if you have no brains right?

And I am quite certain that you do have some brains.

7200 rpm consumer sata drives are not designed for the same load and duty
cycle as a 15k scsi unit...

Plus, in general, you would need a special aftermarket controller and then
again, what about hot swapping etc etc

 - rh

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Abba Communications
Spokane, WA
www.abbacomm.net

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Thread : Anaconda doesn't support raid10

1)

Ruslan Sivak So after troubleshooting this for about a week, I was finally able to create a raid 10 device by...

2)

Ross S. W. Walker Most people install the OS on a 2 disk raid1, then create a separate raid10 for data storage....

3)

Ruslan Sivak Whether or not it was designed to create a Raid5/raid10, it allows the creating of raid5 and raid6...

4)

Toby Bluhm Russ, Nothing here to help you (again - :) just looking down the road a little. If you do get this...

5)

Ruslan Sivak Well, it's been my experience, that in linux, unlike windows, it might take a while to get things...

6)

Scott Silva Ruslan Sivak spake the following on 5/7/2007 1:44 PM: If you have the hardware, or the money, you...

7)

Ruslan Sivak I'm not looking for total reliability. I am building a low budget file/backup server. I would like...

8)

Scott Silva Ruslan Sivak spake the following on 5/7/2007 2:43 PM: I had 2 seperate 2 drive failures on 2 brand...

9)

Les Mikesell I like to keep things simple-minded and not fight with anadconda. During the install, put /boot,...

10)

Ruslan Sivak I have 4 500GB drives. Seems kind of a waste to put just /boot swap and / on the first 2 drives....

11)

Les Mikesell I typically use 36 Gig scsi's for the system. You can use that or even less for the first 3...

12)

Feizhou If this is a file server too, may I suggest that you keep system stuff separate from your data like...

13)

Ruslan Sivak I'm not sure what you mean by "get real old stuff for your controller". The controller is brand...

14)

Matt Hyclak I would not make swap a RAID 0. Ever. It is fairly rare on systems to actually use swap, so they...

15)

Feizhou Suit yourself. I personally do not see the point of 2 spares when your system uses raid6. This is a...

16)

Ruslan Sivak I think you're right. I've lost the raid every time when I pulled out the boot drive. Yea, I think...

17)

Feizhou You have four disks which will be paired into two pairs. If one pair goes, everything goes. Might...

18)

Ruslan Sivak I'm not quite sure I understand? This is raid1, not raid10. While I'm not sure exactly how raid1...

19)

Feizhou NOT everything is raid1 now is it? Your data/system is on raid10 RIGHT?

20)

Ruslan Sivak Well apparently not. I decided to go with 2 raid1's with LVM striped on top of it. The previous...

21)

Feizhou The boot partition on its own is useless as the only thing you will find there are the kernel...

22)

Andreas Micklei Really depends on what you have on your boot partition. ;-)

23)

Feizhou You mean in the initrd images :D But seriously, when you need a /boot partition, it is only as...

24)

Ruslan Sivak This is true. In this particular case, I wanted the boot partition to survive if the data disks...

25)

Les Mikesell I didn't think you were duplicating / across all 4 in the layout you proposed. Thus the questions...

26)

Ruslan Sivak Originally I had boot on 2 drives raid1, with 2 more drives being hotspares. Then I realized that...

27)

Les Mikesell I don't think there is a limit. I have one set built with 2 250 gig internal drives plus one...

28)

Feizhou The entire use all four disks for /boot makes no sense if two disks belonging to the same mirror...

29)

Ross S. W. Walker I think the idea of the 4 partition raid1 was more of, what else is he going to do with the 200MB...

30)

Chris Croome Hi FWIW this is what I did with the last server I built which had 4x500gb drives -- a RAID 1 /boot...

31)

Ruslan Sivak Chris, I didn't have to install grub on any of the other volumes, and the server seemed to do well...

32)

Ross S. W. Walker I think if you setup the 4 disk raid1 at boot grub gets installed on each as part of the install...

33)

Ruslan Sivak Why is this exactly? Does it have something to do with the boot sector or something? Doesn't the...

34)

Ross S. W. Walker Exactly, grub is installed on sector 0, the boot sector, and that sector isn't touched when a new...

35)

Les Mikesell Personally I think he is being overly paranoid about more than 2 disks failing at once since the...

36)

Ruslan Sivak Yes, if two disks belonging to the same mirror go down, I lose my data. But if two disks which are...

37)

John R Pierce so, is your / on a 4 spindle mirror too? N-way mirrors require every write to be done N times.

38)

Ruslan Sivak No, / is on a 2 raid 1 arrays which are striped using LVM. And the N times write penalty doesn't...

39)

John R Pierce so, if the LVM is built from the 2 raid1 sets md1 and md2, and both drives of md1 are down, its...

40)

Ruslan Sivak Well the reason not to put /boot on the same spindles as md1 has already been mentioned a few...

41)

John R Pierce conventional stripesets tend to use a stripe size around 32k or 128k bytes. LVM tends to use a...

42)

Ruslan Sivak The PE could be changed to a lower #. Would this negativelly affect LVM somehow? Russ

43)

John R Pierce the way LVM works, LV's -can- be built from any random set of PE's, so it has to use mapping tables...

44)

Ross S. W. Walker LVM interleaving uses 64K chunk by default and writes these chunks across the extents on the...

45)

Feizhou ext2 /tmp? Anyhow, suit yourself :)

46)

Ruslan Sivak Feizhou, After thinking about it for a little bit, I see your point. If one of the arrays fails,...

47)

Ross S. W. Walker Don't worry about it, the 4 partition raid1 makes perfect sense in your setup not for the reason...

48)

Feizhou Your minimum data and system disks are two. One from each mirror. So if you put /boot on either...

49)

Les Mikesell What't the point of putting this on more than 2 drives? It is versatile, if you don't know where...

50)

Andreas Micklei What's the point in not putting it on all available drives? I have a similar setup here on one...

51)

Ruslan Sivak Well for one thing, if 2 drives fail and it doens't get a chance to rebuild, then I still have 2...

52)

Ross S. W. Walker I figured out how to create interleaved LVs on the install, it is a little PITA though. Start the...

53)

54)

Ross S. W. Walker Hey look at me! I'm top-posting!!! Nanny-nanny-poo-poo Come get me Trolls! You could do the same...

55)

Feizhou Please do not top post. :) Eh? It cannot be worse than PATA drives now can it?...

56)

Ruslan Sivak He was probably hinting at me for top posting. Unfortunately, sometimes I write from the...

57)

Feizhou Hence the smiley. sequential will be better than SCSI due to the packing on those platters which...

58)

Andreas Micklei SAS and SCSI really has it's place when you need random access with lots of IOs per second, i.e....

59)

Les Mikesell I've always wanted a dollars to dollars comparison instead of comparing single components, and I've...

60)

Ross S. W. Walker RAM will never make up for it cause user's are always accessing files that are just outside of...

61)

Les Mikesell I'm not convinced 'never' is the right answer here although you are of course right that cache...

62)

Ruslan Sivak I know you meant it in a joking way. I'm kinda pissed at RIM though for not letting me reply...

63)

Ross S. W. Walker I understand I often use my BB too and get a lot of flak for top-posting. F@ck em Get the...

64)

Ruslan Sivak I can get all that data, but can I actually test it somehow? Does linux know anything about NCQ, or...

65)

Ross S. W. Walker Good question, not knowing the answer I did a quick google and this came to the top:...

66)

Ruslan Sivak Ross, Thank you for the links. Looks like my controller doesn't support NCQ :-(. I have the SIL...

67)

Ross S. W. Walker How did it go creating the interleaved LVs? -Ross

68)

Ruslan Sivak It worked... I think. I already had the LVM partitions set up, but when I booted up into the...

69)

Feizhou How much did your si3114 cost? You can get a si3124 card for under 100USD.

70)

Ruslan Sivak I think it was around $25 shipped.

71)

Feizhou GAH. I guess I would have to find a AHCI VIA board to beat that :).

72)

Toby Bluhm Promise SATA300 TX4 ~ $60 @ newegg Fresh install of centos 5 x85_64: sata_promise 0000:01:0a.0:...

73)

Feizhou Centos 5 should have NCQ/hotplug capable libata

74)

Feizhou Forget it. Your old si3114 does not support NCQ.

75)

Ross S. W. Walker SATA and SCSI/SAS should give comparable single work-load sequential numbers, but most SCSI/SAS...

76)

Feizhou Nope. SATA drives with NCQ support are in the same price range as non NCQ drives, if not the same...

77)

R Lists06 Feizhou, It is only a no brainer if you have no brains right? And I am quite certain that you do...

78)

Feizhou ROTFL. I am sorry but 'consumer' 7200 RPM PATA/SATA drives can very well do 24/7 for years. Did you...

79)

Andreas Micklei Sorry, but you are comparing apples and oranges. Sure the SATA drives look good on paper, and sure...

80)

Feizhou Thanks. So I see. A 2.5" drive (higher density platters? probably all use the same density just...

81)

Ross S. W. Walker I deserved that! Yes, true PATA is definately on the low end, but RLL/ESDI can probably get in even...

82)

Ross S. W. Walker Ok, my bad raid5/6 can be created during install even if OS can't boot from it. I guess raid10 is...

83)

Ruslan Sivak I don't seem to be able to control the interleave through anaconda. Is this something that can be...

84)

Stephen John Smoogen My guess is that software Raid10 is still in the eats its children stage. Most of the time I found...

85)

Ruslan Sivak Well it's not even supported by hand. Anaconda flat out refuses to let you use it. Even when I...

86)

Scott Silva Ruslan Sivak spake the following on 5/7/2007 2:22 PM: I don't think anaconda will support it or...

87)

Ruslan Sivak Anaconda does now support raid6. The only reason I didn't go with it is that I heard that...

88)

Andreas Micklei NEVER EVER use raid0 for swap if you want reliability. If one drive fails the virtual memory gets...

89)

Ruslan Sivak Interesting thing... I build the following set up: /boot on raid1 swap on raid0 / on raid6 /data on...

90)

Andreas Micklei Again: http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Software-RAID-HOWTO-2.html#ss2.3 Swap probably was not used at this...

91)

John R Pierce well, if your drive has the courtesy to die while your computer is shutdown, then you know it will...

92)

Les Mikesell Swap on raid1 has a chance of working through a drive failure. Raid0 doesn't. Does the installer do...

93)

Toby Bluhm Call that raid1 #0. Put the rest of disk1 & 2 into raid1 #1 , put all of disk 3 & 4 into raid1 #2 ,...

94)

Mailing Lists <snip> The above specifications are about Performance. If maximum Reliability is the goal, look at...

95)

Feizhou I am sorry but for quite a while already, both PATA/SATA/SCSI drives have been sharing the same...

96)

Les Mikesell No, but if there is one way it can fail, you can bet it will - and at the worst possible time.

97)

Andreas Micklei I think the point is that RAID is not a substitute for backups. That does not imply what backup...

98)

Feizhou Hear hear

99)

Andreas Micklei What exactly is your problem? From the Software RAID HOWTO: 2. Why RAID? There can be many good...

100)

Matt Hyclak Likely only expecting everyone is a native English speaker. "Hear hear" is sorta like a +1 to what...

101)

Andreas Micklei Ah, ok. :-D Thanks for pointing out.

102)

Feizhou ;) Sorry :P

103)

Mailing Lists <snip> <the reliability factor has been proven to be the same across the board. <You must have...

104)

Les Mikesell I believe that there's not enough difference to matter. There is always enough of a chance of a...

105)

Feizhou and fluctuating temperatures. That is what the Google report and another one found that drastically...

106)

Feizhou They noted that there was no particular difference in failure rates whether they are high...

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